Meant to be Seen

Hi Fellas!

I just got my glasses via FedEx a half hour ago - Been testing them out.

Initial Impressions: Excellent Quality frame. Fits comfortably over glasses and without. Big lenses - can see the whole screen with a large room of comfort.

"We have some concern that left lens of glasses made with 5 degree mistake and because of this we are asking you to measure new glasses in normal position and tilted 5 degree counterclockwise."

From what I have tested, as Vadim (BlackQ said in his e-mail) the left lens is out by about 15 degrees (more than 5 in my opinion). To fix it, I took out the left lens and turned it 15 degrees CLOCKWISE, not counterclockwise - taken from the perspective of the person wearing a set of glasses - and stuck it down with tape.

Performance:

The tinting issue is vastly improved. I can't tell the difference in tinting unless I concentrate and close one eye to compare with the other eye.

Ghosting:
As we know, there are 2 main types of ghosting with the iZ3D: the traditional Image that the other eye sees, and the "sharpening filter" effect.

The traditional ghosting is very much improved. Again, hardly any ghost image shows.

I do not, however, see any difference in the "sharpening filter" type of ghosting.

I will experiment more and paste a pic, as well as my iZ3D glasses report file here when submitting it to iZ3D.

Overall, these glasses are a great success.

I hope we can use this thread to discuss the glasses and report/consolidate our findings.


Thank You iZ3D!
-- Shahzad.

=====================================

Update: Modded Glasses

Rage!

Damn you and your Fed-Ex delivery advantage!

This is cruel because I leave for CES tonight! You will all probably get to try them before me! Grrrrrrr!!!!!

According to iZ3D's beta testing request emailed to all testers including myself, all they asked was that you inform them of your results before posting in the forums. I made this thread a sticky.

Regards,
Neil

argh.. didnt get them yet too.. hopefully tomorrow... neil sometimes we are faster.. everything turns back to you sooner or later.. ahahaha

I got mine yesterday afternoon, tested them yesterday evening and sent the results. BlackQ said I was the first to give back results. I already posted a summary of my thought about the new glasses in the iZ3D forums but I'm pasting it here too.

My thoughts :

• The color difference is much less than with the original glasses. While looking at a blue sky, the original glasses give a slightly red tint to the sky in the left eye. This problems seems to be fixed with the new glasses. A blue sky is blue in both eyes.
• The ghosting does change a little with the new glasses. It seems to be a bit better. However, the left lense angle seems to be slightly wrong while the right lense angle is correct so I could not test properly with jps and videos. I need to tilt my head to the right to lower the ghosting in the left lense, not to the left as BlackQ said.

So I have roughly the same results as RAGEdemon. I think I'll give his quick fix a try. I'll take out the left lense, I'll rotate it and I'll tape it down.

I look forward to your positive results...
when will the monitors be shipped with the new glasses to 'regular' customers?

Update:

This might be a silly post, please bare with me.

I'm having problems following the test procedure:

3. display corresponding test picture on the screen
4. cover the right eye
5. count the total number for squares visible by the left eye due to ghosting

I have many pictures, labled as 4 steps, each step being a different test for different colours. Each step has 4 images. Please look in the .rar file.
The xl sheet only asks for results from one colour but each colour has 4 files:

B (Back)
F (Front)
L (Left)
R (Right)

My question is this: What is the correct way to display these files on the monitor so that I can fill in the xl file?

The stereo video player / image viewer is not mentioned, do I have to use that? If so, which images do I use? I'm pretty confuzzled.

I'd appreciate any help.

-- Shahzad.

This was clarified in the iZ3D forum after someone asked the same question. Only use the pictures labeled with a B and a F. B stands for backpanel and F stands for frontpanel.

The pictures with L and R are only there to show you what you would see if the glasses were totally perfect, that is, you would see no squares in the left eye.

Here's what I did :
I opened the pictures with a B with the default picture viewer of Vista and I placed it on the backpanel. The backpanel is the panel that you see with the naked eye.
I opened the pictures with a F with the default picture viewer of Vista and I placed it on the frontpanel. The frontpanel is the panel that you only see with the glasses on.
I made sure that both pictures were opened with the same zoom amount. I had trouble lining up the two pictures by simply maximizing the two viewer windows because the Windows start menu was visible in only one screen and it caused the viewer to be placed differently in the two screens. To solve that, I maximized the viewer on one panel and on the other panel, I did not maximize the window and I manually placed it with the mouse until I could see with the glasses that I was correctly lining up the two pictures.

There's 4 set of picture. Red (1), green (2), blue (3) and white (4).

Thank You Tril, that cleared things up nicely

Update

Although there are least squares visible at 5 degrees clockwise; in real world gameplay, Imo the best anti-ghosting performance is achieved when the left lens is rotated clockwise to about 20 degrees.

I'd love to know the science behind that

And thanks for the skicky Neil. Best of luck at CES. The Inq thinks there will be a lot of 3D TVs launched there as you are no doubt aware

Fedex brought me my glasses around lunch time today. They been sitting on my desk at work just begging me to go home early. Will post my thoughts in the morning.

I've got some mixed results here.

Performing the color square tests, I found that I could see a whole lot less square with the new glasses. Then I did a simple test, I opened the image test found in the iZ3D control panel. The new glasses showed a whole lot more ghosting than the old ones, which I thought was odd. (focus on the green guy's thumb, it shows the most ghosting, then switch between the two glasses)

I'll be testing them with a game or two later to see how they perform..

ceashure wrote:I've got some mixed results here.

Performing the color square tests, I found that I could see a whole lot less square with the new glasses. Then I did a simple test, I opened the image test found in the iZ3D control panel. The new glasses showed a whole lot more ghosting than the old ones, which I thought was odd. (focus on the green guy's thumb, it shows the most ghosting, then switch between the two glasses)

I'll be testing them with a game or two later to see how they perform..

I noticed the same thing with the guys thumb, however I did notice alot less ghosting on the guys foot with the new glasses compared to the old ones. Also, something interesting with that test image. If I rotate my head slightly to the left like BlackQ asked for the test I noticed a large increase of ghosting on the whole image. However, if I rotate my head far to the right I lose ghosting on everything but the feet and that ghosting gets worst. I have tried this with some of my own screen shots and I get mixed results, some I rotate left and some I rotate right to reduce ghosting.

I modified my glasses by rotating the left lense about 20 to 30 degrees and I went through the tests pictures while switching rapidly between the original and new glasses. Rotating the lense that much reduces the brightness of the left eye a bit but it's necessary to rotate it that much to lowers the ghosting to acceptable level.

Red :
The new glasses show less squares at the top two bars but they show a bit more squares at the bottom two bars.

Green :
I don't see much of a difference between the original glasses and the new glasses.

Blue :
The top bar is about the same for the original glasses and the new glasses. I see less squares on the other bars with the new glasses.

In practice with videos in iZ3D Media Player :
There's roughly as much ghosting but since there's less color difference between the eyes, it makes the ghosting a bit less visible/annoying.

I've also noticed an orange tint in the left lens, and a slightly blue tint in the right lens.

I didn't run the test screens or anything. Just looked at a couple photos with Sview and played World of Warcaraft for a couple hours. My Red/Blue left/right ghosting has been totally eliminated. The clear ghosting (like in the sky) is still there but its much much easier to ignore without the color tint.

How do I get to these test square screens you guys are talking about?

BlackQ (Vadim Asadov) should have sent you the files attached to an email.

Got mine as well. Ghosting is much less on my pair in all situations. The new pair of glasses is much brighter then the old glasses. So not only the difference between right and left but also the overall light is better. I hope iz3d is not angry when i say this here: It is an amazing improvement!! I will send my review to iz3d first before posting values here. Also i placed my monitor at eye level, which means it is 10cm higher then the desk. (it's a pitty it does not have an adjustable foot)

Is there any schedule? When do they want the final results?

Do you test with 1.09 or 1.10b driver?

@Tril
I can't confirm this 20° thing. We all should keep in mind that we could have got different versions of the glasses. Maybe some got the perfect ones others got the ones which will end up in trash can. I have to redo the ghosting test because i did not use the F / B images but the L / R images in sview. Is there no tool which perfectly lines up the images??

I wasn't paying attention before ... but once the new glasses are finalized and available, what is IZ3D's plan regarding existing owners with the old glasses? They'll all get a free pair? They can buy a pair at discounted price (how much)? They have to buy at full price (how much)? Thanks.

I did some more testing, and in games the new glasses are SO much better then the old ones, its odd that the static test image shows a different result, as well as the static wallpaper image.

The color between each eye seems almost perfect (in games). 8)

Hi, ssiu!

We did not have the final answer yet, but I hope we can have clear answer as soon as we'll manufacturing decision - then we'll have final quotation for mass manufacturing and clear understanding of possible replacement economics.

I have to say then more I use these test glasses the more I like them. The colors are much truer and brighter. This was a very very nice surprise. Ghosting is reduced in some aspects. A lot of the purple hued ghosting that plagued a few games/graphic demos has gone by the wayside.

This is a nice improvement and the test glasses will be my most used glasses until we can order new pairs.

Although there are least squares visible at 5 degrees clockwise; in real world gameplay, Imo the best anti-ghosting performance is achieved when the left lens is rotated clockwise to about 20 degrees.

Hi RAGEdemon,

After severel hours of testing with all kinds of games and 3D-pictures I can definitively confirm your findings: The right lens is fine and the left one has be rotatest exactly 22° clockwise from the perspective of the person wearing the glasses. I measured that value exactly with a goniometer.

Like you I detached the left lens from the frame (which is done easily with a litte push on the lens) and mounted it with several different rotation values via tape to the frame. With 22° the overall ghosting reduction was the best!
Finally I could play Bioshock (my most problematic game regarding ghosting) with minimal crosstalk which was at a level no longer distracting!

Can anyone else in the test group confirm this finding!

Ok. Great to hear! The glasses arrived and i've tried them. Also have to rotate my head to the right shoulder to make the left lense better. Not posting any results yet but it sure looks better than old glasses!

Confirmed by me as well.

How we have already 3 people confirming that the new glasses give the lowest ghosting in real world applications with left lens rotated 22° clockwise.

Anyone else?

i had approx 10% less ghosting with the new ones on the boxes test (tilted) but have approx 50/60% less ghosting ingame. i wonder if somebody else had this result too.. what i mean is that it looks like if the images show more ghosting then the glasses actually have.

Ingames i have best results at left lense appr 20° tilted to the right. However: When tilted only 5° right it gives better results on the sheet with the testimages. I filed a report on the excel document anyway and then it's up to iz3d to see what the numbers mean. This might also be a step on the way and the total ghosting experience perhaps isn't that important yet.
I don't know.

I would say your estimation of ingame ghosting with newer glasses experience matches my. But then again i've also tilted 20° to the right.

Wow Thanks Nobsi! You sure cleaned it's chronometers

Have made a bit better job of it than the tape thing now:
Have drilled a hole and put a 2.5mm screw in the corner so it's easy to adjust but still tight enough to not move unless wanted... though you can still see a small line of adhesive that the tape left at the top end of the lens.

Have tried to make it so the 20 deg mark was about where the lens would touch the ground if the glasses were resting opened - to give an easily adjust-to reference point... to the best precision as I could

Thanks Again for taking the time to measure the angle so precisely!

Seems to match my "ingame" fave tilt as well.

When does IZ3D expect to have these new glasses available for sale?

ME want ME want !!

Yeah when can we order these puppies? I want 5!!

wow just noticed this thread. for completeness here are my review videos:

iz3d beta1 glasses unpacking
iz3d beta1 glasses review
iz3d beta2 glasses review

With all of the issues I read about in terms of driver problems, lens problems, convergence errors, ghosting, with the iZ3D...I returned the one I bought from newegg before it even arrived. I decided to go with an active solution for now. The nVidia 3D vision worked great for me. I'll wait a few years before I try a passive solution. Also, I don't like the idea of a linear 3D solution. I'd rather get the circular 3D monitor. It's more expensive, but the results are well worth it.

I also found that iZ3D's customer service (or atleast the person assisting me) was rather rude in their response to a question concerning whether the monitor was linear or circular polarization. I probably would have followed through with my order if he hadn't been that way, because as soon as I read that email I put in a ticket to cancel my order.

If I ever do get a passive 3D monitor I'll go with the Zalman.

Hello Tape!
I am very sorry to hear about your experience with technical support with iZ3D.
If you'd like, you can PM me more information, such as when the ticket was submitted, and I can try to track down the issue for you.

I think you made a grave error here. The NVIDIA solution is great, I'm glad you are happy with it. However, everything you have read about the iZ3D is completely false. Convergence errors? Lens problems?

Keep in mind that the NVIDIA solution doesn't let you adjust convergence unless you turn it on as an advanced feature. Check out MTBS' game review section to get an idea about convergence errors. You can't compare what you can't see. 8) NVIDIA is starting to catch up with better HUD support in games in their 188.85 stereo driver.

Check your sources for the other stuff:

http://www.mtbs3d.com/cgi-bin/newslette ... ews_id=74/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

As for iZ3D being rude, can you elaborate? It doesn't sound like iZ3D at all to be that way - their reputation is very different.

Anyways, back on topic. The new glasses make a very visible difference. I would go with what existing owners have to say - especially if they have the updated glasses.

Regards,
Neil