John Carmack confirms 2nd dev kit is in the works

[Needle]

So that means FOUR Consumer Rift related misreportings so far: "1st consumer Rift will be 4K," "1st consumer Rift will run Android standalone with a SoC," "Consumer Rift will work with iOS but not Android", and now "Consumer Rift will come in 2 flavors, one for PC and one for mobile." Is there something wrong with the media that makes it so extremely difficult for them to properly report the facts?

[TheHolyChicken]

So that means FOUR Consumer Rift related misreportings so far: "1st consumer Rift will be 4K," "1st consumer Rift will run Android standalone with a SoC," "Consumer Rift will work with iOS but not Android", and now "Consumer Rift will come in 2 flavors, one for PC and one for mobile." Is there something wrong with the media that makes it so extremely difficult for them to properly report the facts?

The media has always been this way. You're just noticing it because it's an area you're intimately aware of, and so can spot the errors.

[blazespinnaker]

Oculus is confusing things by how they're talking about Android and the fact that everyone is very excited about a mobile solution so they'd naturally focus on that.

The media gets things wrong, but not usually by this much so frequently.

As I pointed out earlier in this thread Oculus needs to emphasize that Android standalone is Consumer V2. The people hosting the conferences that they're keynoting are even getting it wrong because of the poor messaging that OVR is doing.

Anyways, it's unfortunate that OVR is waiting for Consumer v2 to do Android. Someone else is going to eat Oculus's lunch here.

Clearly the mobile solution is where all the real excitement (outside the 'hardcore' gamers) is.

[TheHolyChicken]

http://www.engadget.com/2013/11/01/ocul ... interview/

They've clarified the situation, in response to the bunch of crappily-interpreted articles that have come out recently. TLDR:

Consumer version can tether to windows/mac/linux AND Android devices. Requires tethering at all times.
In the future (beyond consumer V1) they envisage that they would make a Rift that has its own built-in android device, creating a completely standalone device.

[Dilip]

What do they mean by lighter version?
isn't current version is already light? or do they mean no base station?
Or
Does it mean only HDMI out and no other cables at all?
Or
There will be HDMI+DVI+USB then where that lightness will come from?

Cable management is a rarely mentioned feature that is definitely going through some major improvements.

Thanks! that was great to know. As now its cleared by Brendan Iribe that there will be only one rift catering both PC and Android based Mobile Devices, major improvements in cable management is going to play pivotal role.

Here some suggestions would be

1) Ideally the less the number of cables the best.

2) If possible keep both end of cable with jack (M type) and rift with socket (F Type).
i would like to mention one incident,previously with my CRT monitor VGA Cable was coming out from monitor. Over a period of time it got worn out then as i could not replace it by self. I got to get monitor opened by hardware guy and got fixed a new cable. Now in my LG Monitor it has socket for DVI-D and my GTX660 to have DVI-D socket so when ever cable get worn out i simply got to purchase new one and that’s done. hope you got what i want to say.

3) Retractable Cable would be cool but eventually malfunction chances are high here.

I am waiting for innovation

[Dilip]

http://www.engadget.com/2013/11/01/ocul ... interview/

They've clarified the situation, in response to the bunch of crappily-interpreted articles that have come out recently. TLDR:

consumer version can tether to windows/mac/linux AND Android devices. Requires tethering at all times.
In the future (beyond consumer V1) they envisage that they would make a Rift that has its own built-in android device, creating a completely standalone device.

That cleared the fog around mystical Newegg.!!
Now that we know, its a single device still it triggers questions::

Considering consumer version will be both android and pc supporting.
1) Why they are not putting at least battery socket in base station and
allow people to buy some standard battery (Li-Ion/Li-Poly) from their
place (by getting specification and type from OVR) to achieve limited
mobility with consumer rift?

While OVR may not ship battries themself to avoid inconvenience.
It could be proven best of both the worlds.

2) Which SoC can handle consumer rift in android with playable frame rates? i
see nothing less than Tegra4 or snapdragon 600/800 will be able to do
that. Unless you are satisfied with 'ANGRY BIRD VR' I will like nothing
less then Dead Trigger 2 or Modern Kombat 4 In VR.

As OVR SDK was already integrated in UNITY and UNREAL, I was positively hoping this won't take much in migrating to android. Dead Trigger 1/ 2 are made in unity only. We really gonna need battery socket in base station at least to take mobility joy even if tethered to TAB or PHONE or other mobile consoles (SHIELD= I see 100% worthy candidate here. NVIDIA, CAN YOU RELEASE SCREEN LESS SHIELD IN POCKET FRIENDLY SMALLER VERSION FOR 200 USDs? Then market is yours for taking!!!)


I have few more questions in mind like..

1) Won't it be too tough for even mid range android devices like Nexus
(Tegra3) tab to give good frame rate in consumer rift as its display going to
be HD+

2) Why don't they reduce magnification power so that screen door effect can be eliminated even with DK resolution 1280X800 I am specifically talking about android devices as here it will help in giving good frame rate.

3) With this sort of customisation, independent mobile targeted rift would be more ideal and would have worked much better than what consumer version will (Due to its higher resolution), unless it get powered by LOGAN based SHIELD.

4) Can't OVR Design Their OWN SHIELD like HH Consol with just XBOX CONTROLLER WITH INBUILT BATTERY AND TEGRA4 BORD IN POCKET FRIENDLY SMALLER VERSION and release it along with Mobile Targeted low end RIFT?

5) How about using Fresnel lens with low magnification power thus avoiding chromatic aberration (i think that’s only problem with this type of lenses) as well as requirement for wrapping for android targeted low resolution rift? Are current type of lenses Biconvex? how are the 'Plano convex', 'Positive meniscus' and 'Negative meniscus'? I am certainly not challenging OVR on type of lenses, just curious about what can be the other options to avoid wrapping thus saving processing power specially for android targeted device.

[blazespinnaker]

There will be some sort of battery solution for the Consumer version, it's the whole reason they're adding android support.

[MSat]

There will be some sort of battery solution for the Consumer version, it's the whole reason they're adding android support.

Wait, what? The whole reason they're adding Android support is because they wanted the Rift to have batteries?

[Fractalys]

Oculus needs (to fork) Android and become a platform/storefront for VR content.
Hardware is just a gateway for a sustainable income stream. They will benefit from
network effects and cross the valley of death.

I totally agree with their vision from an economic perspective. As a consumer it just sounds
like additional cost for things I don't really want. Processor, graphics battery etc all add up.

VR content on android just isn't quite there yet compared to PC/Steam (due to vireio). Maybe
DK2 is better for me instead of a consumer version.

[blazespinnaker]

Oculus needs (to fork) Android and become a platform/storefront for VR content.

Android does not exist merely for the sake of Android. Android and iOS and WP8 all exist because mobility is a desired form of computing. The untethered experience of phones, tablets, wearables, etc are all part of the evolution of people merging with computers and computers merging with our everyday living. Google Glass, Smart Watches, .. and yes, the Oculus Rift + Omni.. they're all the next phase of that process. (The end game being when people exist inside of the virtual universe themselves. It will start with direct connects to our brains and end when we upload our conscious beings into the substrate and no longer require our physical bodies. )

Anyways, the whole point of android support is so we can use the Rift with mobility in mind. We can put our android in our pocket and plug our Rift into the android itself like a pair of 'eye'phones. Suddenly, we can take our virtual universe with us wherever we go and don't have to just leave it at home in the computer room. That virtual universe becomes a bigger part of our life.

If we have to plug that Rift into a wall socket, it defeats the whole purpose of this product support. As everyone has pointed out, Android games suck compared to PC games. However, PC's suck for mobility.

There will be a battery solution for the Consumer Rift. It *may* require plugging the Rift into a battery pack you wear on your belt / fanny pack.

That's if they actually do Android support in the Consumer Rift. I am starting to lose confidence in the competence of OVR so who knows what's going to happen.

[Dilip]

Wait, what? The whole reason they're adding Android support is because they wanted the Rift to have batteries?

Its exactly otherway around "The whole reason they're required to add battery support to rift is they wanted to add Android Support"
Android is not DESKTOP OS and certainly 'Soul of Android' rests in mobility. if they are keen to add android support picture this...

1) You have attached HDMI out of RIFT in SHIELD and DC ADEPTOR of RIFT in power socket and you are seating in your computer room playing android games.

Why you do that at first place? just attach that HDMI out to your Meaty Desktop and enjoy VR Splendour your PowerRig can afford. if seating in computer room and playing is case why go for ANDROID it can't offer what your PC can.

2) You have your TEGRA 4 Tab you are seating in Aircraft Travelling form point A to B you have 2 Hours flight time and wish to enjoy some VR gaming.

you have taken out your rift from your laptop bag and you are fumbling around your seat to search power socket so that you can attach power brick/DC ADEPTOR & turn on that Rift for some kickass ZombiHunt.

Do really any airline offer power socket to passengers in flight? may be in business class for phone but in economy forget it! Is your rift targeted to elite? no they said its for all,not like HMZs.

What’s whole point of supporting ANDROID at first place if you require to search power socket where ever you wish to enjoy your android VR game on RIFT? Its utterly pointless.

Android is from scratch made for your Phone/Tab a medium that walks with you its not wrong to teether rift to it but then still rift require to teether to power socket the whole concept of mobility get killed. just to provide cheap console experience like OUYA there is no need to add rift support as its already very well handled by PC.

Regardless, they offer SoC studded version or not if they think of supporting android adding battery is MUST

[Dilip]

Android does not exist merely for the sake of Android. Android and iOS and WP8 all exist because mobility is a desired form of computing. The untethered experience of phones, tablets, wearables, etc are all part of the evolution of people merging with computers and computers merging with our everyday living. Google Glass, Smart Watches, .. and yes, the Oculus Rift + Omni.. they're all the next phase of that process.

+1 i too believe in this.

(The end game being when people exist inside of the virtual universe themselves. It will start with direct connects to our brains and end when we upload our conscious beings into the substrate and no longer require our physical bodies. )

That’s threatening at START, as i have seen Bruce Willis 2009 movie "SURROGATES".

END though seem to enticing, why? 'couse you are talking about IMMORTALITY.
"we upload our conscious beings into the substrate and no longer require our physical bodies"
That will ELIMINATE ALL FORM OF CRIME FROM EARTH. why?
1) No Hunger
2) No Decises
3) No Fear of Death
4) No Greed to get RICHI RICH
5) Ultimately No Reason to FIGHT.........

Anyways, the whole point of android support is so we can use the Rift with mobility in mind. We can put our android in our pocket and plug our Rift into the android itself like a pair of 'eye'phones. Suddenly, we can take our virtual universe with us wherever we go and don't have to just leave it at home in the computer room. That virtual universe becomes a bigger part of our life.

If we have to plug that Rift into a wall socket, it defeats the whole purpose of this product support. As everyone has pointed out, Android games suck compared to PC games. However, PC's suck for mobility.

There will be a battery solution for the Consumer Rift. It *may* require plugging the Rift into a battery pack you wear on your belt / fanny pack.

That's if they actually do Android support in the Consumer Rift. I am starting to lose confidence in the competence of OVR so who knows what's going to happen.

+1 I too STRONGLY believe in this.

[Dilip]

I totally agree with their vision from an economic perspective. As a consumer it just sounds
like additional cost for things I don't really want. Processor, graphics battery etc all add up.

They are not going to put Processor, graphics in consumer model V1. They have self sufficient mini console kind rift in vision of future (consumer model V2/V3) but that too going to support PC any way. but i think there should be provision of at least battery in consumer model V1 if its going to be android supported.

VR content on android just isn't quite there yet compared to PC/Steam (due to vireio). Maybe DK2 is better for me instead of a consumer version.

DK2 will be very much identical to Consumer version V1 due to
1) Lack of time gap between Dk2 and Consumer V1
2) Its requirement to justify existence of whole DK idea

it could be 10/20% different but mostly cosmetics.

[Falan]

I feel very privileged that we have Palmer Luckey actually taking the time to come onto these forums to correct our wild speculation. It is fantastic news about Mr Carmack joining Oculus and with Marshall Cline joining the team it seems many of the best minds in the industry have given you their full support. Amazing work I cant wait to get my hands on the next dev kit or the consumer version! Don't take too much to heart we are all just very enthusiastic for this to succeed too, its hard being on the outside trying to peek in.

[colocolo]

@Dilip

That’s threatening at START, as i have seen Bruce Willis 2009 movie "SURROGATES".

END though seem to enticing, why? 'couse you are talking about IMMORTALITY.
"we upload our conscious beings into the substrate and no longer require our physical bodies"
That will ELIMINATE ALL FORM OF CRIME FROM EARTH. why?
1) No Hunger
2) No Decises
3) No Fear of Death
4) No Greed to get RICHI RICH
5) Ultimately No Reason to FIGHT.........

hehe, just imagine we could change only our faces during sex with augmented reality.....
Everyone is suddenly the 'owner' of all mostly desired women in the world.... .
IMMORTALITY? i have my doubts on that....í personally have no problem with dying....i mean its not that we always lived on earth....humanity only has to overcome its fear of dying and without religion/hereafter/singularity....the rest
comes from alone...Civilization Type AAA.
i think there is a reason why we duplicate. and there is also a reason why only some solar system evolve to
planets with biological life. its like a cosmic order...
if it is all only about falling asleep once, man , then....dont be such a pussy humanity.
i might be proven wrong, but i think there is also no need to hurry for immortality.
Dont underestimate eternity, one day you want to push the button.

[blazespinnaker]

I'm not sure the speculation is really about OVR as much as it is about Vrase versus Durovis versus OVR versus openloop versus Sony versus castar..

Lot of players out there and lots of rapid evolution for the consumer to play with! That's what I find exciting..

[Fractalys]

I'm not sure the speculation is really about OVR as much as it is about Vrase versus Durovis versus OVR versus openloop versus Sony versus castar..

Lot of players out there and lots of rapid evolution for the consumer to play with! That's what I find exciting..

Yep, too much going on especially with motion controls. Thats why I believe Rift + 360 controller will be most popular.
This setup doesn't really need mobility. Thats why I kinda ignored it.

Oculus still is the best option out of all of those.

[Dilip]

hehe, just imagine we could change only our faces during sex with augmented reality.....
Everyone is suddenly the 'owner' of all mostly desired women in the world.... .

That's cool idea what more u want? Hei but why only face rest of body will tell u truth anyway

IMMORTALITY? i have my doubts on that....í personally have no problem with dying....i mean its not that we always lived on earth....humanity only has to overcome its fear of dying and without religion/hereafter/singularity....the rest
comes from alone...Civilization Type AAA.
i think there is a reason why we duplicate. and there is also a reason why only some solar system evolve to
planets with biological life. its like a cosmic order...
if it is all only about falling asleep once, man , then....dont be such a pussy humanity.

I was thinking other way what if u don't need to worry for food sleep or other biological needs. You live in some HDD or On server in network ,can do whatever u want and always have knowledge you acquired which won't end with Ur Death,ain't it cool. Think a knowldge you acquire over millenium and you can still Ctrl+del your self when its too much you feel.though you can't touch feel or taste as that's biological so it renders it self meaningless in end.







.[/quote]

[colocolo]

hehe, just imagine we could change only our faces during sex with augmented reality.....
Everyone is suddenly the 'owner' of all mostly desired women in the world.... .

That's cool idea what more u want? Hei but why only face rest of body will tell u truth anyway

IMMORTALITY? i have my doubts on that....í personally have no problem with dying....i mean its not that we always lived on earth....humanity only has to overcome its fear of dying and without religion/hereafter/singularity....the rest
comes from alone...Civilization Type AAA.
i think there is a reason why we duplicate. and there is also a reason why only some solar system evolve to
planets with biological life. its like a cosmic order...
if it is all only about falling asleep once, man , then....dont be such a pussy humanity.

I was thinking other way what if u don't need to worry for food sleep or other biological needs. You live in some HDD or On server in network ,can do whatever u want and always have knowledge you acquired which won't end with Ur Death,ain't it cool. Think a knowldge you acquire over millenium and you can still Ctrl+del your self when its too much you feel.though you can't touch feel or taste as that's biological so it renders it self meaningless in end.







.

[/quote]

why shouldnt we feel,taste or have super orgasms on a chip? just for fun...or we can have that feelings
during we recharge....
there are some top of the notch prosthesis that are connected with your brain and can let the patient feel cold, hot and touch....
maybe its just that i am a bit too conservative with what life and its meaning is right now for me....
who knows maybe a very long life (few hundred thousand years enough???haha) is a good thing.
yeah it could be cool to decide for yourself when you are going to push ctrl + del.

EDIT: hell ya, should it be possible to make a personal brain mapping(super res MRI) in our remaining lifespan, keeping/freezing ourselves on disks and then later (100years) revive our spirits ? designing personalized neural network arichitecture on chips (memristors with all remaining resistances) ???

[blazespinnaker]

To be fair, it's possible the reality we're in is just a virtual reality simulation.

There's a lot of interesting research going on proving that the physical model of our universe is similar to that of what a large computer must be utilizing to keep track of things.

So the fascinating thing about the rift and the merging of our minds into computers is that as we get closer and closer to creating a simulation where we have fully merge / uploaded our consciousness into the substrate and it is indistinguishable from reality, I think we get closer to proving this thesis true.

The reason is the rift proves two things: one, that intelligent beings want to enter virtual worlds, and two it's technically feasible to do so.

Once we have this assumption, we can look at simple math to prove that we're likely in a simulation ourself (imagine reality as one giant tree, and we're currently sitting in a leaf node trying to upgrade our reality to a branch node).

Nick Bostrom came up with a fascinating argument:

http://www.simulation-argument.com/simulation.html

[yoshithedog]

To be fair, it's possible the reality we're in is just a virtual reality simulation.

There's a lot of interesting research going on proving that the physical model of our universe is similar to that of what a large computer must be utilizing to keep track of things.

So the fascinating thing about the rift and the merging of our minds into computers is that as we get closer and closer to creating a simulation where we have fully merge / uploaded our consciousness into the substrate and it is indistinguishable from reality, I think we get closer to proving this thesis true.

The reason is the rift proves two things: one, that intelligent beings want to enter virtual worlds, and two it's technically feasible to do so.

Once we have this assumption, we can look at simple math to prove that we're likely in a simulation ourself (imagine reality as one giant tree, and we're currently sitting in a leaf node trying to upgrade our reality to a branch node).

Nick Bostrom came up with a fascinating argument:

http://www.simulation-argument.com/simulation.html

I have thought about this idea, and the problem with it is:
the reality in which the simulation is occuring (where the "giant computer" is) would have to have the same or similiar law of psyhics as our reality so that you would be able to build a computer in it. So it would be simulated too. And so on. It's a paradox, since there must be a "parent" reality which is NOT simulated, but it would have to have the same laws of psyhics, suggesting it IS simulated.

[Pokey]

To be fair, it's possible the reality we're in is just a virtual reality simulation.

There's a lot of interesting research going on proving that the physical model of our universe is similar to that of what a large computer must be utilizing to keep track of things.

So the fascinating thing about the rift and the merging of our minds into computers is that as we get closer and closer to creating a simulation where we have fully merge / uploaded our consciousness into the substrate and it is indistinguishable from reality, I think we get closer to proving this thesis true.

The reason is the rift proves two things: one, that intelligent beings want to enter virtual worlds, and two it's technically feasible to do so.

Once we have this assumption, we can look at simple math to prove that we're likely in a simulation ourself (imagine reality as one giant tree, and we're currently sitting in a leaf node trying to upgrade our reality to a branch node).

Nick Bostrom came up with a fascinating argument:

http://www.simulation-argument.com/simulation.html

I have thought about this idea, and the problem with it is:
the reality in which the simulation is occuring (where the "giant computer" is) would have to have the same or similiar law of psyhics as our reality so that you would be able to build a computer in it. So it would be simulated too. And so on. It's a paradox, since there must be a "parent" reality which is NOT simulated, but it would have to have the same laws of psyhics, suggesting it IS simulated.

There is no reason its law have to be similar to our own, they just have to be laws that are stable and can lead to the creation of a simulator. Using our computers, we can simulate worlds with vastly different rulesets. Also, being unable to prove you are in a parent universe is not a paradox. If there are 1000 nested universes and no way to tell how far down in the nesting structure you are, the most likely answer is that you are not the base universe. This does not mean there is no base universe. I don't think anyone is arguing that we are definitively not a base universe, just that it is likely we are not, given certain assumptions about reality simulation.

[cybereality]

I think this recording of Alan Watts is very appropriate right here:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=pl ... vgM#t=1244

[blazespinnaker]

Yeah, maybe, I honestly don't see the practical implications of what Watts is saying though.

The implications of the bostrom argument are very practical however: they provide us with a model for predicting physical laws (and therefore controlling our universe / hacking the machine) as well as a technological path to proving the thesis - complete virtual simulation. Which loops back to the topic of this thread, btw - mobile VR is just another step to total simulation.

I mean, go with that assumption .. total simulation .. assume we actually have a VR sim which is not discernible from reality (not an entirely impossible outcome given the pace of change caused by the revolutionary jump of things like the Rift itself).

I think once people are in such a VR sim populated by artificially intelligent NPCs, it's not particularly a huge leap to assume the possibility that we are in such a simulation ourself.

It certainly makes various mythos, such as the Norse Gods coming down from Asgard, the Greek Gods from Olympus, the Avatar of hinduism - make a lot of sense. In fact, the tree of Yggdrasil .. perhaps thats all it is, a mathematical representation of the tree like structure of the simulations and the root, branches, and leaf nodes.

I guess the only question is though, what happens when all of the NPCs figure out they're living in a sim? Will they restart the sim? Is this an argument that the tree can only have a height of one?

Hopefully Neo can come to some sort of arrangement this time.

[cybereality]

I don't really worry too much about if we are in a simulation, simply because it doesn't make anything less real. I mean, 1+1 still equals 2, simulation or not. Your personal connections with people, the feeling of love, that is still just as real even if we are in some sort of Matrix. So ultimately it doesn't make much difference outside of speculative interest.

[blazespinnaker]

http://phys.org/news/2012-10-real-physi ... ation.html

I suppose since you're not a physicist finding an underlying physical model for the universe might not be interesting to you (though it does impact your life).

However, I think anyone who's seriously in the VR industry would be interested in the implications of what they're proving by creating accurate simulations.

[colocolo]

apropos physics and impact on our lives....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uK367T7h6ZY

[KBK]

I don't really worry too much about if we are in a simulation, simply because it doesn't make anything less real. I mean, 1+1 still equals 2, simulation or not. Your personal connections with people, the feeling of love, that is still just as real even if we are in some sort of Matrix. So ultimately it doesn't make much difference outside of speculative interest.

I find that grunting one's way through the Godelish mess is one way to transcend the complexities of any incongruities.

To investigate the corners and spots where the system does not quite 'fit' perfectly.

When you consider that all of physics is based on fudge factors and is theory only at the deepest levels.. and the only fact in existence is that 'there are no facts', you end up finding that the system has a literal thousands of anomalies that cannot be explained. Immersing in those anomalies takes one to the edge of reality function and then one can peel the layers back.




People can live like a puppy in a cardboard box and bark at me for jumping over the edge of it, for my cutting holes in it, in order to slip out. Their lack of curiosity will not be allowed, by me, to stop or slow me down from exploring further than they may. They (mr & ms average) not seeing more than the cardboard box, essentially. The problem is their fear poses as their basis in logic.. and they use their inability to 'look' as a crutch and limit. They thrust out to try and kill or tear the 'intrepid explorer' down, for endangering their projections on cardboard boxes. Like someone drowning, they grasp at anything, as the body provides via autonomous self protect mechanism. They are without mind in those moments and projections. So called 'intelligence' is no barrier to being in such mental straights, as this idea of intelligence is based on the carrier mechanism, which is an organic being that is ruled, even in mind, via emotions.

Considering the intelligent puppy in the puppy box... we have a box which is bigger and more involved, so they can cover up the access to the walls, with more convolutions and complex stories (complex backdrops).

And in that moment, inadvertently, or even purposely...tell lies to those who are more mundane of mind - without even knowing it. Caught in a circular trap, unable to see the walls, fundamentally fearful of things they cannot see. Ignorance as safety. We see it in various ways, in multiple 'ordinary' situations, every day. It also exists here, in the fundamentals of the definition of this world.

When you consider that almost every single person on this planet, when pressed (to think it through, or back to the given time), has had an incident (at least one unexplainable, via any known physics and science means) in their life that transcends the standard model of physics and reality as we know it, we get to a minimum of billions of incidences. And that, as a single method of making one turn to look, is indisputable. When we get to looking (without bias), we find thousands of different types of 'holes', not just the stories of incidences on the personal level. Thus we have a stable group of billions of instances and moments/scanrios to consider.

Which means that standard model of physics is totally shitcanned and inaccurate at a level that is literally...beyond mundane belief. When we engage this thought or area of thinking, we find that there are thousands of texts that are thousands of years deep, to help one begin the process of understanding those aspects of a more complex and involved reality.

Humanity can grow, but it does tend to need a swift kick in the ass to get it done. And, in that moment of confusion and fear (reaction comes before logic), it will generally reach out and try to kill the messenger.

[Drewbdoo]

apropos physics and impact on our lives....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uK367T7h6ZY

Thorium is totally the fuel of the future. The only problem, as I understand it, is that drain tank is his diagrams doesn't really exist yet. Material sciences hasn't (yet) found a way to make a tank that the molten salt won't just eat through. But even when they is achieved, it's going to be a long uphill battle against the energy suppliers who have vested interests in keeping coal/oil/nuclear and deep, deep pockets to pay out lobbyists. My deepest concern is with humanities inability to look beyond the now or this week. Things which take the scope of a human lifetime or more are inconceivable to most people. I'm afraid that we're going to set fire to the atmosphere before we do anything to stop our march to oblivion because the problem seems down the road and no immediate.

[colocolo]

yes thats true....but luckily material scientists all over the world are really digging into that problem.
oh yeah politics and the financial sector... that is actually the real problem...they are creating energy dependencies all over the world, playing fool the world.
thats why thorium is so important. not that it could also give humanity superpower like thor has, you can also use reamaining 45-50%process heat for all kind of things , especially desalinating water(thurst) and producing fertilizer(hunger). Furthermore there is the issue of rare earths. Main rare earth mining companies in the world throw a big junk of rare earth away because it contains, tada Thorium. its actally classified as nuclear.
funny thing is that those are 40% of rare earth needs of total world in a year.
the indepedence is important since many economy experts already argue that thos several billion dollar buisness with rare earth mainly lead by china is indispensible for a multi trillion dollar industry in the world , thus a high risk to all economies relying on that resources.
politics, financial sector,military and media would misuse this fact as a legimitation to attack China.
although in the long term it would destroy many employements it could also open many new paths, like
extensive space tourism, moon/mars.. stations...really fast space ships propelled with VASIMR and LFTR that could maintain constant ac/deceleration of 9,81 m/s² to Titan or Io . (assuming Reaction engines and their one stage reusable spaceship Skylon will succeed.they actually plan to sell many of them,much like boeing/airbus does)

http://www.industrytap.com/thorium-fuel ... tury/15649

[Libertine]

Maybe our existence is Hardcore Mode. No respawn, no HUD, no mini-map, one-shot kills, no pop-up hints, the rich allowed to abuse a free economic system to the max. Although some people seem like their on normal mode now that i think about it. Wonder what the hackers are doing (dammit), ugh. Maybe Africa is the hardest hardcore mode. Depends on the purpose of it i guess.

Seriously, Simcity is the most popular game series right? That says a lot about the possibilities of "life" being a hardcore SIM for quite possibly bored immortals, perhaps violence/threat of violence/that kind of excitement is only allowed in SIMS, perhaps they're trying to create something authentic, in the future? Maybe there is a DM (god) leading us to a particular set of [pseudo-authentic] conditions to live in (Star Trek(hopefully Next Generation though)). Although i do think that happiness not being a 24/7 thing can be (fixed) and is simply a result of evolution. So i think that this SIM would be just a break between century or more long bouts of happiness. So not bored immortals.

Ugh, this atheist digresses.

[Endothermic]

The only problem, as I understand it, is that drain tank is his diagrams doesn't really exist yet. Material sciences hasn't (yet) found a way to make a tank that the molten salt won't just eat through.

Why do you think that?
http://www.energyfromthorium.com/pdf/NA ... rience.pdf

A test reactor was run for 5 years (with uranium instead of thorium) in the 60's and it had drain tanks that had no problem with the molten salt. Did turn out that neutron irradiation greatly reduces the stress life of the Hastelloy-N they and the reactor vessel, piping etc were made out of but the whole point of the drain tanks is to stop the nuclear reaction so there won't be that much neutron irradiation not to mention there will hardly be anything in the tanks since they are only used when the reactor is shutdown or there is a problem.

Since that was over 4 decades ago I don't see why we would have a problem with a material for the drain tanks, even if we used the same material from back then. The reactor vessel which experienced a lot of neutron irradiation since it was critical for almost 2 years (and run continuously for 6 months at one point) had no problem lasting all that time. Even if you had to replace the reactor every 4 years (wouldn't need to replace the tanks since they would only be exposed to a fraction of the amount the reactor is) the reactors are quite small (could literally put one in your home) so it wouldn't be that much of an expense.

[Alejux]

Wow! Amazing how a thread about John Carmack's comment on the 2nd dev kit, can suddenly turn into a conversation on mind-uploading immortality and thorium nuclear reactors.
Please keep it up.

[colocolo]

The only problem, as I understand it, is that drain tank is his diagrams doesn't really exist yet. Material sciences hasn't (yet) found a way to make a tank that the molten salt won't just eat through.

Why do you think that?
http://www.energyfromthorium.com/pdf/NA ... rience.pdf

A test reactor was run for 5 years (with uranium instead of thorium) in the 60's and it had drain tanks that had no problem with the molten salt. Did turn out that neutron irradiation greatly reduces the stress life of the Hastelloy-N they and the reactor vessel, piping etc were made out of but the whole point of the drain tanks is to stop the nuclear reaction so there won't be that much neutron irradiation not to mention there will hardly be anything in the tanks since they are only used when the reactor is shutdown or there is a problem.

Since that was over 4 decades ago I don't see why we would have a problem with a material for the drain tanks, even if we used the same material from back then. The reactor vessel which experienced a lot of neutron irradiation since it was critical for almost 2 years (and run continuously for 6 months at one point) had no problem lasting all that time. Even if you had to replace the reactor every 4 years (wouldn't need to replace the tanks since they would only be exposed to a fraction of the amount the reactor is) the reactors are quite small (could literally put one in your home) so it wouldn't be that much of an expense.

if you think of all the expenditure that is now being undertaken to lift 12 billion tons/year of fossil fuel and the whole industries (ships,oilplatforms,mining,pipelines, machines,................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................) that are connected with it. pouuuuuhhh
Compare this to 5000t Thorium a year. 15 tons a day....one truck load
We could live like gods hanging out in a marvellous VR all day!

[colocolo]

http://www.mobileburn.com/22190/news/sa ... care-about


good news actually for a Rift II! Japan display also already demonstrated a sample that showed ultra hd density....
actually smartphones owners with retina displays will very likely benefit from these resolutions. they just dont know it yet.
fov2Golike cardboards will sell like cookies....

[xhonzi]

Why would they make such a thing?!?

[MSat]

Why would they make such a thing?!?

Possibly for the same reasons they make 8-core mobile processors? Hopefully these displays will indeed make it into future HMDs..

[blazespinnaker]

two reasons:
Maybe there is a perceptible difference between so called retina displays and even higher resolution

or

they're going to develop a product to be used with magnifying lenses.

I can't think of any other reason.

[colocolo]

at least when they see Oculus VR is selling millions and millions of units they might take a look at it.
Perhaps this is the way Ultra HD is going.... i cant see how TV manufacturers could now sell hundreds of millions of
(at least) 65 inch 4k TVs. (cause you dont see pixels otherwise)
That would be almost a quadruple increase in average panel size(36.8" in 2012). Have they already build that many new factories?
OLED wallpapers would be the way to go if it comes to 8k TVs.
They would need to print them to catch up with production.

[Dilip]

What will be resolution of DK2 and Consumer Rift??

1) 2560X1440 @ 5.5"
2) 1920X1080 @ 5/5.5"
3) 1920X1200 @ 7"

Though strong intuition is Option 2
i will be happier in Option 3 and KUDOS to Palmer at Option 1

or Will there be 6" 720P curved OLED?
though that doesn't excite much due to fact that its still 720P

The Design i guess will be cross breed between current DK and kickstarter Render,
so suggests the winner of HMD Damien Labonte's Concept design.

Oculus selected V2 but i think ARZ1 gives clues of presence of positional tracking via led markers
(He did not mentioned that though, but P.t. is must) so if oculus choose positional tracking via led markers then V2+ARZ1 cross breed needed.

BTW geekmaster posted (in response to my request to Palmer to keep multicolor indicator led in eye logo) that glowing oculus eye on rift does not bare any importance.
Now you can see the design chosen by Oculus !! Eye sees all,glowing one sees beyond!!
[URL Removed by cybereality - appeared to have a virus in it]

I was always of opinion that current DK looks Crude and ideally futuristic HMD should look like KS Render